Coal Mining in East Leeds

[The Parksider]

chameleon wrote: You seem to appreciate our dilema in terms of the source of the feeder, references are made to this being Wyke Beck but that doesn't seem to tie-in with what can be seen. So today I had a field trip.At the junction of Ramshead approach and Ramshead drive you can see the watershed and head of two valleys. To the right bailey's rein and to the left....well read on.Our proposition was there was a stream that ran from Ramshead through Foxwood that may have fed Foundry Mill.There is. The Ramshead watershed and Baileys lane where the stream crossed in the 1800's is today split by north Parkway, but in line and futher down (kentmere rise) the stream can be found across kentmere avenue from the rise.Unlike the upper reaches of Bailey's Rein and the valley down Moresdale lane it flows with water and was probably the strongest tributary to wyke beck.There is about 80 meters of it out and back into culverts. The street alongside is is called Rosgill. I think we have Ross Gill.Tracing it down through Foxwood there is a large inspection chamber on the foxwood playing field and the culvert appears at Wyke beck opposite Arthur's rein culvert.But our proposition was that a watercourse was cut around the hillside to take Ross Gill water onto the Foundry Mill Ponds.Looking at the terrain and levels I feel that the watercourse followed the contour around the hillside and just about made the back of Foundry Mill.

[The Parksider]

chameleon wrote: You seem to appreciate our dilema in terms of the source of the feeder, references are made to this being Wyke Beck but that doesn't seem to tie-in with what can be seen. So today I had a field trip.At the junction of Ramshead approach and Ramshead drive you can see the watershed and head of two valleys. To the right bailey's rein and to the left....well read on.Our proposition was there was a stream that ran from Ramshead through Foxwood that may have fed Foundry Mill.There is. The Ramshead watershed and Baileys lane where the stream crossed in the 1800's is today split by north Parkway, but in line and futher down (kentmere rise) the stream can be found across kentmere avenue from the rise.Unlike the upper reaches of Bailey's Rein and the valley down Moresdale lane it flows with water and was probably the strongest tributary to wyke beck.There is about 80 meters of it out and back into culverts. The street alongside is is called Rosgill. I think we have Ross Gill.Tracing it down through Foxwood there is a large inspection chamber on the foxwood playing field and the culvert appears at Wyke beck opposite Arthur's rein culvert.But our proposition was that a watercourse was cut around the hillside to take Ross Gill water onto the Foundry Mill Ponds.Looking at the terrain and levels I feel that the watercourse followed the contour around the hillside and just about made the back of Foundry Mill.

[chameleon]

Just bringing this back to the top so I don't loose it! Sterling work - must get the maps out later.

[The Parksider]

chameleon wrote: Just bringing this back to the top so I don't loose it! Sterling work - must get the maps out later. I got a second look at the area and if you stand on Brooklands view outside Foxwood School gates you can see where Ross Gill comes down and it actually is pointing in the direction of across south parkway and into the top of foundry Mill street so you can get a really good idea of how that stream cut around the hillside.On the maps, on more than one the gill runs paralell with the 200 contour around the hillside.I wonder wether you feel that is a "natural" way for any valley beck tributary to run???Long ago the beck may have run down to wykebeck as I suggested and there's a circular 200 contour that is a small hill which today is the end of brooklands avenue.On maps you will see a line run from Ross Gill down the hollow between the 200 contour around the hillside and the single hillock 200 contour. That line today is Brooklands drive.I can only surmise that ross gill did run through the fox wood and naturally between the 200 contours down to Wyke beck but that they cut a water course across to the Mill giving a "T" junction just below Fox wood you will see on several maps.Wether there was a sluice there and they opened the course when they needed it I am unsure. I say this because although I believe the watercourse made the mill I do not feel it made the ponds - I would be interested if you feel the pond outlet to mill is above the watercourse and therefore the mill ponds could not feed the mill, Ross Gill watercourse did it direct??On sundays and in the night they would not have needed the feed so maybe they shut the sluice and the water ran down the gill down brooklands drive??? That run is a very straight line and again that may also be a watercourse rather than the natural turns and twists of a stream.????????Such lengthy watercourses can still be traced in the dales. I also have a feeling when Smeaton sorted out the waterwheel he may have wanted a different flow of water and so would you be suprised if he may have engineered this possible watercourse as well??Finally was there a stream feeding the ponds - well yes there was but was it strong enough. maybe not - anyway at the foot of the valley that the ponds were in their are three culverts into Wyke Beck so that flow of water is still going down that line!

[The Parksider]

chameleon wrote: Just bringing this back to the top so I don't loose it! Sterling work - must get the maps out later. And finally that "Map showing watercourse from Ellers close (Dibb Lane/Asket Hill junction) to Foundry Mill.Well maybe that was the old watercourse before Smeaton. After all Burt states the Wyke Beck was dammed at that point which when you stand at that area you can see how high the dam would have had to be to raise the water level up towards the 200 contour so it would be above the mill.But the map Burt shows has nothing 1577 (when the dam and course were built) about it more like 1894 so I just don't know what that map is? has someone suggested Mathers watercourse location superimposed on a later map from a time when Mathers watercourse was no longer there, but Smeaton's(?)was????Any Idea about this Victorian Map showing a Tudor watercourse???David Owens modern day history of East Leeds states that "This (smeatons waterwheel) used water "forced" from a conduit extending from the wyke beck at Roundhay.But do post Smeaton maps show a conduit extending from Roundhay still and why was the water "forced"???Owens states Smeaton had designed for Temple Newsam a hydraulic ram that "forced" water up to a height of 26 feet and thus up to the level of the house". Was a hydraulic ram used to push water up to Foundry Mill???Where's Mr. Grumpytramp?

[chameleon]

Whooa! You've given me a lot to go through there Parksider and I feel a short field trip might be needed weekend permitting.One thing is certain - what we read by others does not seem to be the whole story does it?Where abouts on the Foxwood site do you think the chamber is which you mention? I have one or two niggles of seeing things but, that was along time ago wasn't it?

[Hector]

To state the obvious, the route of Wykebeck has being changed. I remember seeing a map in the reference library showing the original and new route. Unfortunately there was no detail to show where the changes took place.

[The Parksider]

Hector wrote: To state the obvious, the route of Wykebeck has being changed. I remember seeing a map in the reference library showing the original and new route. Unfortunately there was no detail to show where the changes took place. Yeh I know that has happened, but when you go there essentially there is the valley bottom probably 20+yards wide and wherever the stream ran somehow the water had to get up to the mill which is a distance above the level of the stream even though the course may have changed.

[chameleon]

Hector wrote: To state the obvious, the route of Wykebeck has being changed. I remember seeing a map in the reference library showing the original and new route. Unfortunately there was no detail to show where the changes took place. Yes indeed, thank you Hector. We are looking at documents and maps back to 1850 and before here, and it does seem that there could be several feeds to the Mill with Wykebeck being but one possibility.Although the course will have changed, it does of course always remain close to the lowest points of the shallow valley.

[chameleon]

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