Leeds Lost Pubs - Part 2

Old, disused, forgotten and converted pubs
georgecusick
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Burley area

Postby georgecusick » Thu 31 Dec, 2015 12:24 pm

Hi
My mother lived in Newcastle Street in 1940-1950 with my grandmother and grandfather and my aunt lived in Durham Street. I have only just found that out as due to some problems my mother had wiped that period of her life out of her memory. I have done some research now and found out quite a lot and I have looked at the pictures of the area on Leodis which I showed to mum who was absolutely thrilled. I have had trouble piecing together the streets around the area at the time as they are now all gone but I noticed your fantastic superimposed map of the old and new parts of Burley together. Can I ask you where you got the old street map as i would like to have a least a portion of it? Mum mentioned a bombed out house in either Newcastle or Durham street. Can you help with this also? Many Thanks.
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liits
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Re: Leeds Lost Pubs - Part 2

Postby liits » Thu 31 Dec, 2015 6:46 pm

I'll knock one together for you. In the meantime, here's a screenshot of the NLS side-by-side version.
Newcastle - Durham.jpg
Newcastle - Durham.jpg (1.1 MiB) Viewed 2237 times
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liits
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Re: Leeds Lost Pubs - Part 2

Postby liits » Thu 31 Dec, 2015 7:40 pm

Newcastle St Composite Small.jpg
Newcastle St Composite Small.jpg (1.15 MiB) Viewed 2224 times
Here's an overlay map of the area. The Google Earth image is [I think] from 2009 and the map itself is the 1908 OS, so it obviously predates any WW2 bombing and bombed out house.
volvojack
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Re: Leeds Lost Pubs - Part 2

Postby volvojack » Sat 17 Sep, 2016 5:54 pm

OTLEY PUBS.
Having spent a great and happy part of my life in Pubs mainly in and around Leeds can anyone tell me the state of the pubs in Otley these days. going back over 60 years ago at lunchtime we used to go by bus on Bank Holiday Monday's as the Pubs were open all day. this was when the normal licencing laws were strictly 3pm. closing. We were just under legal age but used to drink until about 4pm. and then go lay by the river dozing, back to the pub when the sun went in and had a couple more pints before catching the bus back to Leeds.
We only ever went in Tetley's houses and from memory there was one in the Market Square. (?) Happy Days.

volvojack
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Re: Leeds Lost Pubs - Part 2

Postby volvojack » Sat 17 Sep, 2016 5:54 pm

OTLEY PUBS.
Having spent a great and happy part of my life in Pubs mainly in and around Leeds can anyone tell me the state of the pubs in Otley these days. going back over 60 years ago at lunchtime we used to go by bus on Bank Holiday Monday's as the Pubs were open all day. this was when the normal licencing laws were strictly 3pm. closing. We were just under legal age but used to drink until about 4pm. and then go lay by the river dozing, back to the pub when the sun went in and had a couple more pints before catching the bus back to Leeds.
We only ever went in Tetley's houses and from memory there was one in the Market Square. (?) Happy Days.
iansmithofotley
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Re: Leeds Lost Pubs - Part 2

Postby iansmithofotley » Sat 17 Sep, 2016 10:11 pm

Hi Jack,

There are still lots of pubs in Otley. Over the last few years, one or two have closed down and there are one or two new ones. Also, some of the pubs have been re-named.

At the moment there are around 20 pubs in Otley , including The Roebuck, (formerly The Spite, at Clifton, just outside the Otley boundary on the Blubberhouses road) and the Royalty on Yorkgate above Otley Chevin. Over the last century, there have been about 26 pubs that have closed down. There are a few ‘new’ pubs, which have opened within the last few years.

My favourite pub in Otley is the Old Cock, which is opposite the bus station and is about 5 years old. It is a pure ‘drinking pub’ and there is no TV or other entertainment (other than very occasionally upstairs) and under 18’s are banned. Over the years it has been many things including a forge, a house, the Curlew Café and the Sugar Street Bistro (Crossgate, where it is situated, used to be called Sugar Street). The Tap House on Boroughgate opened about 3 years ago and it used to be a cycle shop and other types of shop previously. Over 20 years ago, the bus station was made smaller and a new shopping precinct called New Inn Court was created. In the precinct is a pub/bar called Rocca, which, I understand, is for younger people. It has been open for around 5 years. The last of the new pubs is the North Bar, which is a former shop in a passageway off Bondgate opposite the Fire Station.

In the last 10 years, a few pubs have closed down. The Summercross, on Pool Road has been closed about 8 years and is still empty. It is an eyesore and was supposed to have been converted into a care home but it never happened. The Yeoman (previously the Fountain) on Gay Lane (Leeds Road) closed down 7 years ago and was bought by an adjoining company called Tate Fuel Oils. I think that the firm wanted to develop it but could not get planning permission for ‘change of use’ so it is still empty. The Woolpack on Bondgate (opposite the Fire Station) closed down in 2011 and is now a music and arts centre. The Westbourne on Bradford Road closed down in 2007 and is now an Asian restaurant. In 2000, a new pub appeared on Bridge Street on the site of a shop. It was called the Suburban Bar but changed its name to the Bridge, about 3 years ago, but shortly afterwards, it closed down and is now flats.

The Bowling Green on Bondgate (opposite the Fire Station) is now a Wetherspoons pub. The Three Horse Shoes on Bridge Street became the Lix, then the Three Horse Shoes again, for a short time, and now it is the Horse and Farrier. The Spite on the Blubberhouses road became the Roebuck in 2011 (which was the original name). The Ring o’ Bells off Bondgate is now the Otley Tavern.

There used to be 3 pubs in the Market Square but there is now only one – the Black Bull. The last pub to close down was the New Inn, which has been a Superdrug since 1988. The other pub, which closed down in 1962, was the Leeds House, which still has the same name but is a café.

So far as relates to the Licensing Hours, I think that up until the change of the licensing hours, in the 1980’s, when pubs were allowed to open all day, the hours in the West Riding area were 11am until 3pm and 5.30pm until 10.30pm (and later 11pm). I seem to remember that the ‘closing time’ in the West Riding was half an hour after it was in Leeds and people used drink in Leeds until ‘closing time’ and then rush to Horsforth, Morley, Pudsey, etc., in order to get a later drink until the later closing time.

In those days, if pubs wished to open at other times, then they had to apply to the local magistrates for an exemption. Often, for things like parties and wedding receptions, etc., they would apply for a Special Order of Exemption, which would allow them limited extended hours for the event. The other type of exemption was a General Order of Exemption, which pubs still had to apply for, but was (I believe) renewed annually. This enabled pubs to open at other times depending on local needs. For example, Otley used to have two cattle markets (Monday and Friday) and market days on Friday and Saturday. In order that people (farmers) attending the cattle markets could get a drink all day, some of the pubs had ‘General Orders of Exemption’ and they opened from morning until closing time on cattle market days. The pubs used to have a plaque fitted on the wall outside stating the exemption and the opening hours. In other areas, for example, such as Sheffield (night shift steel workers), Grimsby (night shift fishermen and operatives), London (fish and flower markets workers) some of the pubs also had this type of exemption and might be open from 4am or whatever depending on the needs of the trades.

The other place to drink, in the afternoon, after the pubs closed at 3pm until 5.30pm, was clubs, which had a different type of licence (Registration Certificate). You usually had to be a member or an ‘affiliated member’ under the Club and Institute Union rules which allowed clubs to be reciprocal. So, the heavy drinkers in Leeds could be in the pub at 11am until 3pm and then straight to a working man’s club (or similar) until 5.30pm and then back to the pub again until closing time. If they wished to drink later still, then they had to go to premises with a Special Hours Certificate which enabled them to be open until 1am or 2am. Nowadays, I am out of touch with the licensing laws so I don’t know what the situation is with different types of licensed premises.

Here is a good website about the pubs in Otley:

http://www.otleypubclub.co.uk/

Ian
volvojack
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Re: Leeds Lost Pubs - Part 2

Postby volvojack » Sun 18 Sep, 2016 9:26 am

Thanks for that info. Ian, the Black Bull pub name in Otley sounds familiar though it was just a good quality ale house in those days.
jma
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Re: Leeds Lost Pubs - Part 2

Postby jma » Mon 19 Sep, 2016 10:24 am

Ian

That's an example of somebody who studied thoroughly for their "classes" (police promotion exams) and still has a good memory to retain it all. :D

My own memory of the Otley licensing hours is of a driver involved in a daytime shunt somewhere down Sheepscarr in 1978. He wasn't falling down drunk, so to speak, and a couple of less-experienced colleagues were incredulous when I said he needed breathalysing. Positive, and off to the Bridewell, where they were field-testing the machines which would eventually replace blood and urine specimens. He gave it a blow and the inspector announced that his blood/alcohol level suggested he had drunk 5 or 6 pints. My man cheerfully announced that the machine must be broken as he had been on a three-day pub crawl including two days in Otley, separated by a day-long visit to the beer tent at Pateley Bridge Agricultural Show. I can't remember the eventual figure which came back from the lab but it was high enough to have killed a lesser man: he was a bricklayer, and built like a brick ... er ... outhouse.

iansmithofotley
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Re: Leeds Lost Pubs - Part 2

Postby iansmithofotley » Mon 19 Sep, 2016 6:58 pm

Hi Mick,

The problem is that, sometimes, nowadays, I can't remember what I did last week. However, I can still remember the definitions and police powers that I learned, word for word, at Pannal Ash Police Training Centre in 1965. Unfortunately, 80 per cent of that legislation has now been repealed. It's the same with collar numbers, I can still remember many of the Leeds City Police collar numbers, as mentioned earlier in this thread but I could not tell you the name of one member of the present Command Team of the current force.

Ian
volvojack
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Re: Leeds Lost Pubs - Part 2

Postby volvojack » Mon 19 Sep, 2016 9:18 pm

Don't know if this Pub has been mentioned here or if it is still open or long gone. It was on Meanwood Road on the traffic lights junction where the road to the left went up to Headingley. I believe it was Melbourne house. A good night for music as I remember

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