Rawdon WW2 defences

The Parksider · Post by **The Parksider** » Mon 07 May, 2012 9:18 am

simong wrote: There are the ROC buildings and the gun emplacement platform on the Billing. There was another emplacement on Baildon Moor and another on the Chevin near East Carlton to protect the northern approaches to Leeds and Bradford and the AVRO factory. Any location for the Chevin one Simon thanks for the reply

The Parksider · Post by **The Parksider** » Mon 07 May, 2012 9:20 am

Whyme wrote: Yorkshire water sold a building off last year which sounds like it.The building was for a pumping station for the long gone water works or something like that.Remember reading the auction details for the sale of a bit of land and the small building containing pumping equiptment, pipes etc...Maybe same place.The auction was by eddisons if that helpsMaybe its the same building. I see no real connection between the bunker and the 20x20 building although they are smack next to each other!!!Time to look at old maps!

BLAKEY · Post by **BLAKEY** » Mon 07 May, 2012 9:33 am

The Parksider wrote: Thank you Phil for the piccy and Blakey - where was the exact location of the AVRO harrogate Rd bunker I'd love to go see that one.... I wish I could help Parksider, but it is over forty years ago and I honestly can't remember exactly where on the site it was - I do seem to recall that there weren't as many established businesses there then though. I can only suggest that you perhaps call in at, say, the Helicopter training school or similar and ask if they happen to know where it was - I daresay some remains like those in the picture can still be seen.

BarFly · Post by **BarFly** » Mon 07 May, 2012 12:54 pm

The site in Phil's pictures is the old gun emplacement off Otley Old Road here: http://g.co/maps/4723bThe ROC bunker is opposite the old AVRO factory here: http://g.co/maps/ngryqIt can just be seen from the road -- if you're lucky you can walk right into the compound though I've only got as far as the gate. I was googling to find out whether there was a ROC post on the Billing and it came up with this:http://www.urbexforums.co.uk/showthread ... April-2010

blackprince · Post by **blackprince** » Tue 08 May, 2012 8:28 pm

somme1916 wrote: Wonder if they were ever fired ???? ( in anger,test or otherwise). Hi Somme, they were definitely fired in action and the AA guns at Otley Chevin were themselves bombed.Here are a couple of extracts from eye witness accounts:-"During a bombing raid in the early hours of Monday 19th August 1940 over sixty incendiary bombs were dropped on Otley Chevin. Several craters, 25ft wide, were made, rabbits killed and a few walls damaged. In Otley Museum shrapnel from these raids can be seen. Two nights later the Carlton village was bombed. It is thought that the factory was not a target as it was never hit those nights or any other.""on the night of 19m. August 1940. A Heinkel 111 of Kampfgeschwader 53 dropped high explosive and incendiary bombs on the Chevin, near to the site now occupied by the Chevin Lodge Hotel. We all thought at the time that the target was RAF Yeadon and the Avro factory that was under construction nearby, but apparently the pilot was off course and thought he was bombing Leeds, according to post war studies (by Gerald Myers for his excellent book "Mother worked at Avro") of LufiwafFe records. It appears that he was so surprised at the reception he received when searchlights and the light ack-ack battery at Carlton crossroads opened up, closely followed by the heavy ack-ack at Adel, that he reported on his return that there must be something important in the area. So a week later they sent a Junkers 88, a much faster light bomber, which came up Wharfedafe and round the Chevin, and dropped some more bombs, roused the reception committee and fled. After the first raid, the Home was scattered with shrapnel from the airbursts of the anti-aircraft fire, and my father found one of the canisters that had held a batch of incendiaries, known as a "Molotov Cocktail", on the hockey pitch. We felt that we had had a close shave, but I only recently found out how close when I received a copy of the official plot map of the bombs that fell. There were about 60 incendiary bombs, ten high explosive bombs, not all of which went off, and two very unusual bombs that were high explosive and filled with oil for greater effect which fortunately failed to detonate and were taken away by bomb-disposal experts for examination. The incendiaries fell in a wide grouping to the east of the main cargo, and came within a few hundred yards of the Home, so we had quite a near escape."Sources:http://www.projectinspire.kk5.org/#/lee ... 7827.shtml

somme1916 · Post by **somme1916** » Wed 09 May, 2012 1:37 pm

blackprince wrote: somme1916 wrote: Wonder if they were ever fired ???? ( in anger,test or otherwise). Hi Somme, they were definitely fired in action and the AA guns at Otley Chevin were themselves bombed.Here are a couple of extracts from eye witness accounts:-Sources:http://www.projectinspire.kk5.org/#/lee ... 7827.shtml Thanks blackprince-some good,interesting accounts there.Much apreciated mt friend.Somme.

Si · Post by Si » Thu 10 May, 2012 12:29 pm

Quote from Blackprince's source, above."The light anti-aircraft batteries at Carlton crossroads were on either side of Harrogate road; the one above Green Gaits [sic] farm was very accessible, and was on the site what is now the animal rescue centre, and the living accommodation, in a wooden hut, was just through the field gate which is used for access to the car boot sale in the big field to the south of the crossroads. I went there several times....and was allowed to sit on the seat of the Bofors gun and rotate and elevate the weapon. The other site was larger and less accessible.....in the field between Otley Old Road and Carlton village, near Penny's Farm." Has this light AA site at Green Gates farm been mentioned before on SL? I knew about the other sites (Carlton and Billing) but I didn't know about this one.

blackprince · Post by **blackprince** » Thu 10 May, 2012 8:42 pm

Si wrote: Quote from Blackprince's source, above."The light anti-aircraft batteries at Carlton crossroads were on either side of Harrogate road; the one above Green Gaits [sic] farm was very accessible, and was on the site what is now the animal rescue centre, and the living accommodation, in a wooden hut, was just through the field gate which is used for access to the car boot sale in the big field to the south of the crossroads. I went there several times....and was allowed to sit on the seat of the Bofors gun and rotate and elevate the weapon. The other site was larger and less accessible.....in the field between Otley Old Road and Carlton village, near Penny's Farm." Has this light AA site at Green Gates farm been mentioned before on SL? I knew about the other sites (Carlton and Billing) but I didn't know about this one. Hi Si, My local knowledge is not good enough to attempt an answer to your question except to comment that I recently came upon a couple of online maps which show a far greater number of Heavy Anti Aircraft Artillery (HAA) sites clustered around Leeds than I had ever imagined from reading SL accounts.This one gives you a quick idea of the number of sites http://www.anti-aircraft.co.uk/HAA_gun_ ... ap.htmlbut a ( more useful?) file which overlays the positions of HAA sites and airfields , dummy sites etc in Google earth can be downloaded fromhttp://archaeologydataservice.ac.uk/archives/view/dob/( just download the kmz file and open it in Google Earth). Maybe some of these sites remain to be explored The source's reference to the light anti-aircraft batteries at Carlton crossroads is a bit puzzling because the main site was operated by the 644th HAA regiment and housed 3.7 in bofors guns. Maybe there were some lighter anti-aircraft guns also sited in the area.

Si · Post by Si » Fri 11 May, 2012 9:32 am

Thanks for the info, Blackprince. I'd guess that a mix of heavy and light AA was quite common, as it must be very difficult to track a fast, low flying plane with a big 3.7" gun.

The Parksider · Post by **The Parksider** » Sat 12 May, 2012 12:08 am

BarFly wrote: The site in Phil's pictures is the old gun emplacement off Otley Old Road here: http://g.co/maps/4723bThe ROC bunker is opposite the old AVRO factory here: http://g.co/maps/ngryqIt can just be seen from the road -- if you're lucky you can walk right into the compound though I've only got as far as the gate. I was googling to find out whether there was a ROC post on the Billing and it came up with this:http://www.urbexforums.co.uk/showthread ... April-2010 What a star you are sir- thanks for that!!