Leeds trolleybus scheme delayed further

[Leodian]

cnosni wrote: These trolley buses in Wellington are 90 years old so they would probably have gone anyway. In the report it states "In 2017, the 60 trolley buses that have carried Wellingtonians around the city for the past 90 years will be replaced with hybrid diesel-electric buses". That is ambiguous as it could just be poorly worded meaning that the trolley bus service has been going for 90 years. If the trolley buses really are 90 years old then they have given amazingly long service.For interest (and to raise a ) this is a link to an image in Leodis taken about 1920 (roughly the possible age of the Wellington trolley buses) that shows a local trolley bus with the caption "c1920. Double decker trolley bus no 510 on route to Farnley":- http://www.leodis.net/display.aspx?reso ... SPLAY=FULL.

[The Calls]

YEP 1.7.14Inquiry into Leeds trolleybus rumbles onhttp://www.yorkshireeveningpost.co.uk/news/lat ... -1-6702090

[tyke bhoy]

The system may be 90 years old this trollybus certainly isn't http://goo.gl/maps/PHQovEdit to fix URL    

[BLAKEY]

On Radio Leeds this morning there was a "phone in" and studio speakers on the subject - as is usually the case some of the comments sadly showed that many members of the public are prepared to trot out completely uninformed comments, indicating that its doubtful whether they even know what a trolleybus actually is. Also the endless references to trolleybus "schemes" and "networks" show that people don't realise that this obscene amount of money is to be spent on what is virtually one route along most of which the majority of the journeys will still be provided by conventional buses suffering the same delay as at present, or worse.Larry Budd, the "Breakfast" presenter, referred to the alternative green "Borismaster" now being demonstrated as perhaps the way forward as an alternative to the trolleybus as it is a "Routemaster style bendi." !! The barmiest comment from a listener who obviously wanted to be "heard on the radio" claimed that - wait for it - "TROLLEYBUSES NEVER WORKED IN BRADFORD AND THEY WON'T WORK IN LEEDS." From 1911 to 1972 the Bradford trolleybus system was one of the most admirable, respected, extensive and successful systems anywhere in the Country outside the Capital and was also the last survivor until it closed for insurmountable external reasons like massive City centre redevelopment, spares difficulties, and expensive electricity.

[Brunel]

MP tables parliamentary motion stating NGT ‘is not the best option for improving public transport in Leeds’                http://tinyurl.com/q6f55vz

[raveydavey]

BLAKEY wrote: On Radio Leeds this morning there was a "phone in" and studio speakers on the subject - as is usually the case some of the comments sadly showed that many members of the public are prepared to trot out completely uninformed comments, indicating that its doubtful whether they even know what a trolleybus actually is. Also the endless references to trolleybus "schemes" and "networks" show that people don't realise that this obscene amount of money is to be spent on what is virtually one route along most of which the majority of the journeys will still be provided by conventional buses suffering the same delay as at present, or worse.Larry Budd, the "Breakfast" presenter, referred to the alternative green "Borismaster" now being demonstrated as perhaps the way forward as an alternative to the trolleybus as it is a "Routemaster style bendi." !! The barmiest comment from a listener who obviously wanted to be "heard on the radio" claimed that - wait for it - "TROLLEYBUSES NEVER WORKED IN BRADFORD AND THEY WON'T WORK IN LEEDS." From 1911 to 1972 the Bradford trolleybus system was one of the most admirable, respected, extensive and successful systems anywhere in the Country outside the Capital and was also the last survivor until it closed for insurmountable external reasons like massive City centre redevelopment, spares difficulties, and expensive electricity. Radio Leeds are absolutely terrible for this sort of thing. I can understand the presenters not having an encyclopedic knowledge of every subject, but the preparation and research must be nonexistent and any semblance of impartiality is usually the first thing out of the window.Still, at least it wasn't Liz Green.....

[Uno Hoo]

Am I missing something here? Worstbus has been showing off its Borismaster in Bradford as well, and I don't understand the attraction. I've ridden on the type many times in London and have yet to see how it's any better than other modern makes which don't require an extra crew member standing around like a spare whotsit at a wedding in order to operate. Follybus seems to be a gargantuan waste of money, with Borisbuses a close second. Mind you, Worst ensures that on its 72 & X6 services one never waits long for a bus on the Leeds/Bradford corridor. But how economic are the crew-operated bendi-slugs?

[LS1]

First can never win. When they took the conductors off the buses everyone went mad. Now they potentially could be back on the buses there is a feeling of them not being needed - mainly because we have become so used to the drivers undertaking both roles. Before deregulation Leeds City Transport was being run at a loss. All you have to do is look at the the relevant documents to see that it was being subsidised by the council. The fleet was old, outdated and not always fully functional. The mechanics in those days must have worked marvels to keep them going. Today we have a transport company that although not perfect (what company ever is) provides comfortable travel that is very cost effective. Can you imagine the wage bill, fuel bills, maintenance, rents etc that First have to pay? They have over 2,000 drivers in the region not to mention the back office staff that keep the timetables going, complaints, revenue etc etc. They do a pretty good job keeping things going. They are trying to provide an alternative system to the Trolley Bus which should not be ignored. In this day an age with the advances in efficient transport systems we are missing the point that a trolley bus is not really needed as hybrid vehicles are just as good if not better. The real answer to reducing journey time is not attaching a bus to a pole. It is to provide specific reserved areas for the buses to run on. Until this problem has been solved there will be endless arguments about the way forward. Unfortunately though it seems the areas where most of the congestion is there is not the physical space to implement reserved bus ways.     

[Riponian]

Conductors were good at speeding up loading at stops, regulating the behaviour of passengers and in term of "revenue protection". However we're moving towards cashless buses, oyster style prepaid cards are coming soon, where no-one buys a ticket on a bus so one less job for the driver to do.I'd dispute the costs, First have had a near monopoly for a long time and have milked us poor passengers with over inflation rises in the long term.Back to Follybus, it does concentrate on a route that is the most expensive to modify, has a nearby rail route that could be upgraded to take some of the traffic off, and would still get stuck in traffic in the City Centre. Traditionally in Leeds the busiest (and most profitable) routes are the Moortown/Roundhay - Middleton ones, which strangely enough have been left out. They'd also be the cheapest to equip with spaghetti. Funnily enough, dominated by First.

[jim]

We should remember that the purpose of the majority of the proposed new transport "solutions" is not to replace the exiting services that cater to the citizens of Leeds, but to attract out of town commuters etc to leave their vehicles in car parks on the city periphery and travel into Leeds by speedier systems thus (hopefully) freeing up existing road systems and reducing congestion.Many of the SL posts on the subject focus on the direct transport needs of Leeds residents, who are not the users that the proposals seek to target.